Discover
Above Average Intelligence"We Defy:” A Chat with Former Green Beret Jack Murphy on his New Book Honoring the Heroes of the Special Forces Community
Above Average Intelligence"We Defy:” A Chat with Former Green Beret Jack Murphy on his New Book Honoring the Heroes of the Special Forces Community
"We Defy:” A Chat with Former Green Beret Jack Murphy on his New Book Honoring the Heroes of the Special Forces Community
Update: 2024-12-09
Share
Description
Marc sits down with former Green Beret Jack Murphy, author of the brand-new book, "We Defy: The Lost Chapters of Special Forces History," to talk about the book and why telling these stories not only honors the greats who served our nation, but also allows the American people to have transparency on how our tax dollars are very wisely spent. Plus, a chat on the evolution of Jack’s “Teamhouse” podcast, his time at Columbia University and his subsequent writing career, and his pending deep on Havana Syndrome.
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
Comments
Top Podcasts
The Best New Comedy Podcast Right Now – June 2024The Best News Podcast Right Now – June 2024The Best New Business Podcast Right Now – June 2024The Best New Sports Podcast Right Now – June 2024The Best New True Crime Podcast Right Now – June 2024The Best New Joe Rogan Experience Podcast Right Now – June 20The Best New Dan Bongino Show Podcast Right Now – June 20The Best New Mark Levin Podcast – June 2024
In Channel
Download from Google Play
Download from App Store
United States00:00
00:00
1.0x
0.5x
0.8x
1.0x
1.25x
1.5x
2.0x
3.0x
Sleep Timer
Off
End of Episode
5 Minutes
10 Minutes
15 Minutes
30 Minutes
45 Minutes
60 Minutes
120 Minutes
Transcript
00:00:00
[music]
00:00:03
This is Above Average Intelligence, a production of the DSR Network.
00:00:09
Each week, host Mark Polly Mirapoulos is joined by leading voices in the intelligence community for expert analysis on the biggest security challenges around the world.
00:00:21
[music]
00:00:30
Welcome to the podcast on Mark Polly Mirapoulos, and this is DSR's Above Average Intelligence Show.
00:00:35
Today, I am very happy.
00:00:37
Actually, I'm thrilled to welcome as my guest, Mr.
00:00:39
Jack Murphy.
00:00:40
I'm going to read you a little bit about his bio, but Jack has turned into a friend, and he's certainly been on his podcast several times, so now I get to ask the questions.
00:00:49
This is going to be fun, but Jackson, eight-year Army Special Operations Veteran, who served as a sniper and team leader in third-ranger battalion, and as a senior weapon sergeant, and a military free-fall team in fifth-spiritual forces group.
00:01:01
Growing up in New York, Jack Murphy elisted in the U.S.
00:01:04
Army at age 19, completing infantry-based training airborne school, and a Ranger documentation program who's assigned to third-ranger battalion as a Ranger who served as an anti-tank gunner, sniper and team leader,
00:01:15
and also graduated from Ranger School and sniper school.
00:01:17
Several deployments to Afghanistan and Iraq.
00:01:20
He also attended the Special Forces Assessment and Selection course, and was selected as a Special Forces weapon sergeant.
00:01:26
Over a year, we spent training in the Special Forces Q course, including further weapons training, Sear School, Language Training, and more.
00:01:34
He left the military in 2010, the little time at Columbia University.
00:01:40
The author of numerous books, and of course, he is the host of the Teamhouse podcast, which I've been on several times.
00:01:47
I've loved going on there.
00:01:47
We'll talk about it a little bit.
00:01:49
I've had a blast.
00:01:50
He's been appropriately, I think, a controversial sometimes, and not kind of just taking the conventional veteran vet bro route down on some issues.
00:02:01
And most importantly, and why I promised Jack, I would do this.
00:02:04
He's here today.
00:02:05
This is Pub Day for his new book We DeFi, The Lost Chapters of Special Forces History.
00:02:10
Jack, welcome to the show.
00:02:11
Hey, thanks, Mark.
00:02:15
And, yeah, I mean, when you say, you know, controversial, you know, like going against the grain a little bit, I mean, you and I have both had a bit of this experience here with, with Havana Syndrome, that, you know,
00:02:26
there's a segment of the media that just went along with the party line.
00:02:29
And, you know, that's, that's, that's unsat.
00:02:32
That's a, that's not acceptable.
00:02:34
Well, let's, let's, we'll talk about Havana Syndrome in a sec.
00:02:38
But it's, let's just jump into a little bit then kind of about the podcast.
00:02:42
And, and, you know, one of the things, well, first of all, I've been on, I think four or five times, I, I got, I got to still, you know, I got to still have to keep the record going.
00:02:49
But one of the reasons, one of the things I love that, you know, you go into this two and a half hour kind of deep dive.
00:02:55
But you're not there to say the CIA is great, or, or Navy SEALs are great, or, you know, the Rangers are special, U.S.
00:03:02
Special Forces is great.
00:03:03
There's sometimes your critical of it.
00:03:05
You kind of, you know, to tell it like you see it, and so not everybody agrees, and that's the beauty of the show.
00:03:10
So, could you talk about, and I'm, I'm taking a page from you when you kind of go over people's, you know, life, their, their journey, their stories, you know, from the, from the beginning.
00:03:19
How did it, how did the team house come to fruition?
00:03:22
How do you, how do you decide this is going to be something that might be a special, a little bit different than it is what I said before, kind of the vet, bro, rara, kind of podcast, which is just not reality.
00:03:33
Yeah.
00:03:34
Yeah.
00:03:35
Yeah.
00:03:36
I mean, some of that probably comes because I mean, as you, you outlined, you know, I spent eight years in Army Special Operations, but I mean, that's, that's a, a chapter of my life that's closed at this point.
00:03:46
I mean, I got out almost, you know, 14 years ago now, and I've worked in journalism for about 12 years or something like that.
00:03:54
So I think I took that approach into the podcast and a lot of the contacts and people that I met in the course of being a journalist,
00:04:05
you know, some of the people we interview on the show are like former teammates of mine, which is always really cool.
00:04:10
But a lot of them, most of them are contacts and, you know, that I, I built up, you know, working as a journalist and working as a writer and an author and writing the sorts of, you know, the,
00:04:21
the book that we're going to talk about in a little bit.
00:04:23
So that's maybe where why the approach of the show is a little bit different than some of the others.
00:04:28
And I think that what it succeeds doing is bridging sort of the gap between, yeah, sort of like that bro type show,
00:04:38
but also it's not like a stuffy academic show either, that, you know, it is maybe comes across a little too stale or a little too reserved,
00:04:50
you know, for the audience, you know, I think people speak quite freely on the teamhouse for the most part.
00:04:56
We also, we sit there and you can, you know, for, and you're, your producer D, who is a fellow Greek like me, you know, so we always joke, I'll have like a, you know, a couple of maybe glasses of Uzo,
00:05:07
you guys will hit the bourbon in the sky.
00:05:09
So it's a lax, it's fun.
00:05:10
And in the end, you wake up, you're like, what the hell did I say last night?
00:05:13
Well, that's why I have a, I have a self-imposed rule on that about not pre-gaming.
00:05:19
So when the show starts, you pour yourself a glass, and maybe you have two glasses during the show, but you do not pre-game, that never goes well.
00:05:29
So one of the things that's that I found that's pretty cool is, you know, in all the kind of weird stuff that I did, whether it's some doing stuff for MSNBC or I, sometimes I have the kind of unofficial consulting gig with the Philadelphia Police Department,
00:05:41
but people come up to me all the time because they've seen episodes.
00:05:44
And, no, it's good because, you know, and I have to kind of think back, of course, what I said, but, you know, you give the guests two and a half hours to actually, you know, tell the world about themselves.
00:05:56
It's not a three-minute hit or a five-minute hit.
00:05:58
You really kind of dive deeply into some folks, and I think people learn about, you know, this, the world of special operations intelligence, not only from the war stories that they tell, and that's always fun, but also from these are,
00:06:09
these are actually normal real people, and, you know, a lot of their life struggles as well, and I think that's really important.
00:06:14
Yeah, I mean, if that's something that we can accomplish, I mean, I'd be super happy to, you know, to humanize these guys a little bit.
00:06:22
I mean, I understand that they're lauded often as like, almost like superheroes by the American public, and for some very good reasons, but they are human beings, you know, and as human beings,
00:06:34
and some of the things that these guys go through, they also need some help sometimes, and, you know, they have families, and they love their kids, and, you know, they're very much human beings as well.
00:06:46
So, you know, so one of the things that I think of you as this warrior poet, I mean, you know, I mean, there's this kind of the classic scenario in which you're deployed somewhere,
00:06:58
and you're the one reading, you know, a thousand-page book or novel or something.
00:07:02
But honestly, the journey from, you know, your special operations world, and going to Columbia, you know, what was that like?
00:07:10
Why did you always have this idea that there was something kind of, you know, bigger out there for you?
00:07:16
And the other notion is you also did take a bit of a risk.
00:07:18
I mean, you know, this is a little bit of, well, not alternative media, it's not classic.
00:07:22
You're not writing for the New York Times.
00:07:24
You're taking a risk, but I think you're pushing the envelope.
00:07:26
So, if I call you a warrior poet, what's that, what is that reaction that you're smiling now?
00:07:30
Yeah, I mean, well, I never thought, I don't think anyone would describe me as a poet.
00:07:34
But I guess I'm flattered that, you know, I assume that just means I have some writing ability.
00:07:40
But, you know, you're not totally off base there either.
00:07:44
I was the guy on deployment who would come back from a mission, and like a total psychopath, I could sit there and read a book.
00:07:52
And, you know, I, so I was always, maybe I was always more inclined in that direction than I was, to be a special ops guy at the end of the day.
00:08:04
Maybe that's the case.
00:08:04
But also, I mean, back to our conversation about these people being human beings, you know, you can be more than one thing in life.
00:08:12
You can be a special ops guy and you can go to school and you can get a degree in literature or something if that's what you want.
00:08:20
I actually, when I got out of the army, I was going to be, I was interested in international business, imports, exports, that sort of thing.
00:08:30
I ended up, when I went to Columbia, Columbia doesn't have business or international business as a major.
00:08:37
So I shifted initially, I was looking at history.
00:08:40
I hated the history department and transferred to political science.
00:08:44
And that's what I ended up getting my degree in.
00:08:47
But yeah, I mean, there's, there's culture shock there, going from, you know, Ranger battalion and special forces to, you know, Ivy League college.
00:08:57
But overall, you know, and I still live in New York City, I stuck around and I live in Brooklyn now.
00:09:03
And overall, I think it was a really good experience for me, both going to school, but also living in the city, because you're around so many people all the time.
00:09:12
It has this sort of effect where, you know, we read all of the horrible things that you see, you know, on the news and on social media and stuff like that.
00:09:21
But I feel like I have this opportunity to like every time I step outside my door and I see all these people like you see reality.
00:09:28
And it's not the horrible thing that's being represented to us day in, day out.
00:09:33
And if I lived in a more rural area, I mean, nothing against that for people who enjoy that kind of life, but I feel like I would, it would be a lot easier for me to just isolate myself, you know, and not really interact with people.
00:09:45
Yeah, you can go out, you can go live, you know, with Mick and everyone out in, you know, like Montana.
00:09:51
There's nothing out there to meet Mick.
00:09:53
Yeah, that's the, that's out there.
00:09:55
That's out there.
00:09:55
No, it's nice.
00:09:56
But I think you're right.
00:09:57
I mean, you know, one of the things I, it was last week to be before whatever it was, I had to do a day trip to New York City and I had to go to Philly.
00:10:03
You know, my son is, you know, wants to be a police officer.
00:10:06
So he took him up for some, some testing and Philly.
00:10:09
And then I was in DC for something.
00:10:11
So three cities where if you watch the news, there should be, you know, carnage and, and, you know, all sort of like you walk out of your, you know, your own alley, your car and you're going to get attacked by, you know, thousands of what,
00:10:22
you know, the migrant chain coming to terrorize my coming to eat up that mark.
00:10:27
It seemed okay.
00:10:29
Like I was, I was pretty happy, you know, I got myself an H&H bagel in New York City and then Philly, I got a cheese steak and, you know, so I think you're right.
00:10:36
I think there is something to be said, you know, you guys, you end age, your co-hosted park, you know, you host the show from New York.
00:10:43
That is a real place where people, you know, are not, you know, dying by the, by the dozens every day.
00:10:48
So I think that's important.
00:10:49
And one thing I would say is going on set with you is I think is, I know it's hard as we're doing this remotely now, but going on set, I've encouraged one.
00:10:57
When I've had my friends, obviously I've certainly encouraged them to come on to your show.
00:11:02
And that's, I think that's been successful, but when they go on set, it's way more fun.
00:11:05
Yeah, yeah.
00:11:06
And it's a more interesting show.
00:11:08
Yeah, the conversations are always just that much, they just go that much smoother when you're able to do them in person.
00:11:14
Well, not everybody can get there in person.
00:11:17
So I mean, the, you know, having people zoom in is a good alternative, you know, as opposed to like not doing the interview at all, you'd hate to let some of those pass by.
00:11:25
All right, we're going to jump into the book.
00:11:28
We defy the lost chapters, a special force, special forces history today is publication day, right, pub day.
00:11:33
I know you've been talking about that on, on social media.
00:11:36
So congratulations.
00:11:37
That is always a huge thank you.
00:11:39
Kind of milestone.
00:11:41
I took a shot, wrote a book once you guys plugged it nicely.
00:11:44
And it's one of those things.
00:11:46
It's pretty cool because you know, no one can ever take that from you.
00:11:48
Okay, you know, I look at some of the reviews on Amazon.
00:11:50
Some people love it.
00:11:51
Some people hate it, but I say, fuck him.
00:11:53
I don't care.
00:11:53
I wrote it.
00:11:54
I mean, it really it's a living breathing.
00:11:56
Yeah, yeah.
00:11:56
So it's a, it's a, it's a, it's a pretty cool experience.
00:11:59
I know you've done it before.
00:12:00
But for this one, talk about your motivation.
00:12:02
Why did you decide to write about this?
00:12:06
Because so much of it has to do with stories that, you know, we don't know.
00:12:09
The public doesn't know.
00:12:10
Yeah, this, you know, obviously unique outfit.
00:12:12
But some of the great things they did over the years.
00:12:16
Well, yeah, for, for me, it really started out as my personal curiosity and, and to understand something for myself.
00:12:24
Because a lot of this stuff that I talk about in the book, they're most, most of the programs are defunct.
00:12:33
One is not, but most of them are Cold War era constructs.
00:12:37
And you would hear whispers about them within special forces and like somebody would have some notion of like, yeah, we had guys undercover in Berlin or, you know, there used to be this mission where guys trained to jump behind enemy lines with backpack nukes.
00:12:52
But nobody knew more than that, right?
00:12:54
That was kind of it.
00:12:55
And there was no books about this stuff.
00:12:57
There was no place that you could go and look it up on the internet.
00:13:02
The only way you would ever know about this stuff is if you met the guys who were directly involved and like got them to sit down and tell you over a beer.
00:13:12
Most Americans don't have that opportunity.
00:13:14
And neither did I when I was a young soldier.
00:13:16
I had no way to get access to these people.
00:13:20
But those thoughts and those, those questions reverberated in the back of my mind.
00:13:25
And so I set out to write about them myself.
00:13:28
And, you know, I think the first piece I wrote was about blue light, which was America's first counterterrorism team.
00:13:37
And it took me a long time to get in touch with some of those guys, but I ended up talking to two of the officers, the sergeant major and a bunch of other people.
00:13:47
And so slowly it started to come together.
00:13:50
And I always had this notion that and people told me it should be a book, you know, they want we want to see this, you know, published as a book.
00:13:59
And I just knew I had to gather enough material for it to actually become a book.
00:14:04
And it's really I've been working on this thing off and on for like 10 years.
00:14:08
And it's just in the last year that I could start to see the light at the end of the tunnel.
00:14:13
And took, took everything I had and put it into like a word document to see how much do I have and looked at it.
00:14:20
And I was like, OK, yeah, this, this actually looks like it could be a book here.
00:14:25
And then it's just, you know, the deal when you're in writing, I mean finalizing those last couple interviews, last final bits of fact checking and then all the formatting and everything else that goes into it.
00:14:37
So I decided, yeah, I'm going to put in a bit of extra work and I'm going to get this thing done in 2024.
00:14:43
So it'll be out there.
00:14:46
With the election of Donald Trump staying informed is more important than ever.
00:14:50
And we're thankful you've chosen to listen to the DSR network.
00:14:54
Through the turbulent times ahead, we will continue to provide the insightful expert analysis on the issues that matter most around the world.
00:15:02
We ask that you consider becoming a member to support our effort to provide you the best content possible.
00:15:08
DSR members gain access to an ad-free listening experience, exclusive members only segments of our shows, our members only discord community and more.
00:15:18
We use code holiday 25 to get 50% off of your membership subscription at the DSR network dot com slash buy.
00:15:27
That's code holiday 25 at the DSR network dot com slash buy.
00:15:32
The DSR network will evolve in exciting ways in the new year and we hope you'll join us.
00:15:44
So there's a question that I get a lot as I've talked about, you know, the intelligence community in public and of course I do go through very carefully or the CIA's publication review word because you know,
00:15:55
one does have this secrecy agreement.
00:15:56
So I can't talk about a lot of things that that you know my friends and I've done without the agencies approval.
00:16:03
But I do think and this is my question to you.
00:16:07
I do think it's important, particularly in this age of where there's a lot of distrust of, you know, for government and some of the secret aspects of government.
00:16:16
I think some transparency is important because look, you know, American taxpayers, the one who funds these things.
00:16:22
Exactly.
00:16:23
I felt like I always work for you, American people.
00:16:25
I'm sure you felt that as well.
00:16:26
So is that a, you know, I guess the question is, will this help, you know, as Americans learn about this incredible history of US special forces and what they've done.
00:16:36
My argument would be this is actually important, even though I bet some of the people you talk to were like, I don't, I didn't ever think I'd ever be able to talk or even be willing to talk about.
00:16:45
The transparency is good for that reason.
00:16:47
And we have to, you know, we all, we actually after all did work for, you know, for our fellow Americans, right?
00:16:53
Yeah, I mean, I think in my mind there's three main audiences for this book.
00:16:58
The first is for the veterans, the green berets who served in these units themselves.
00:17:03
And, you know, I think they deserve the recognition.
00:17:06
And I hope that this is the kind of book they would want to give to their kids or their grandkids and say, this is what I was a part of, you know.
00:17:13
The second audience, I think it's really important to reach out to young Americans, especially young special operations guys to help them know what their lineage is.
00:17:25
I mean, this isn't my history.
00:17:27
This is special forces history.
00:17:29
It belongs to all of these guys.
00:17:31
I'm certainly not the gatekeeper of any of it.
00:17:35
And then the third audience is, yeah, as you point out, the larger wider American public, the American voting taxpayer, who does need to know what these guys did.
00:17:48
And if we want the public to support these sorts of, you know, in this case, special forces capabilities, we need public support.
00:17:56
And this has always been the push and pull with special forces in particular, who they call themselves the quiet professionals, and mostly they are.
00:18:06
But if you're too quiet, you're not, you're not, I don't want to use a term advertising, but you do have to sell yourself a bit, even within the US government,
00:18:17
you know, if you want continued funding.
00:18:19
Well, that's a good point because, you know, budgets, you know, there's finite resources.
00:18:25
I mean, budgets are something I think, you know, especially now are going to be taken, people can take a very close look at.
00:18:31
And so you do have to make that kind of that justification.
00:18:34
You know, without giving too much about the book, so people don't buy it, we definitely want people to go get the book.
00:18:43
Give us, maybe give us a sense of one or two of the most unique characters that you found, because I think one of the things in our old world is there's always really interesting people that you end up talking.
00:18:53
There are, there are super interesting people and unfortunately, because some of these gentlemen are, you know, they're not getting any younger and several of the people that I interviewed for the book have passed away.
00:19:06
One of them was Taffy Carlin, who's a colonel, he served in blue light and fifth special forces group and and in green light, the backpack,
00:19:17
new team.
00:19:18
And then he went on to become a Delta Forest officer and I think I think his colleagues called them like the professor or something like that.
00:19:26
He was just such a cerebral guy with like this deep knowledge of history.
00:19:30
And when I approached him about writing about blue light, he was like, okay, but I had to fly down to Fayetteville and meet him down in southern pines and and we had a beer at what is it?
00:19:45
O'Connell's in southern pines, this special forces bar down there and he shared his story with me.
00:19:52
I mean, it's just incredible.
00:19:53
I miss the guy.
00:19:55
Another one was Mike Adams, Sergeant Major Mike Adams, who by the time I met him, he was like this really kind of like grumpy, trusty old special forces,
00:20:05
Sergeant Major, but had a really good heart.
00:20:08
He always did and he's just a super cool guy and had all kinds of wild experiences.
00:20:13
He did stuff for the intelligence community.
00:20:16
He took to the grave.
00:20:18
He would not tell me he did not tell his family.
00:20:20
He was just that kind of guy.
00:20:22
But I was able and he was willing to talk to me about green light and I interviewed him for the book.
00:20:27
And then most recently.
00:20:30
The gentleman who I interviewed for the book passed away, Rocky Far or Doc Far and Doc Far was both a doctor, like an actual MD and also a colonel in special forces and is really a legend in the green beret community,
00:20:50
but especially I think in special ops medicine, you know, trauma medicine.
00:20:54
He's just a huge name in that and he served in Vietnam and then went became, you know, everything else that he did and I interviewed him about his time in detachment A in Berlin,
00:21:05
the guys who are undercover had the stay behind mission during the cold war.
00:21:10
So those are three guys that I interviewed who are no longer here, unfortunately, but I'm really proud to have them in the book and to help,
00:21:20
you know, maybe tell at least a part of their story.
00:21:22
Yeah, that's a legacy that maybe their families can kind of look at, too, it's something going to be written.
00:21:27
This book will be kind of a living testament to that.
00:21:29
I know, I know Mike Adams family will enjoy it.
00:21:33
I was at his wake, you know, over the summer and got to meet his widow and his kids and everything.
00:21:39
So yeah, it matters to them.
00:21:41
Talk a little bit about the relationship between my old outfit, the CIA and the soft community.
00:21:48
You know, one of the things that I, I saw that after 9/11, of course, we were kind of, you know, put together just because we were in the same,
00:21:59
in essence, AO, we're in Afghanistan.
00:22:01
But between Afghanistan, Iraq, Syria, Yemen, all these places, I actually grew up with a lot of members of the special operations command.
00:22:09
And so there actually was some trust built between the two sides.
00:22:14
I guess what my question for you is, and I think you know about that, but, but looking back to some of these stories from special operations courses even earlier, you know, perhaps I'm wrong in that assessment that it didn't start just in after September 11th,
00:22:29
the relationship between CIA and soft went back to the Cold War.
00:22:33
Yeah, is that what you found as well?
00:22:36
Yeah, there has always been a nexus between the CIA and special forces or the special operations community in general.
00:22:45
And a lot of that goes back to if you trace it all the way back to the OSS.
00:22:50
And those guys had a part in founding both special forces in the CIA.
00:22:54
So there's a there's a built-in connection kind of from the get go.
00:22:59
And that continues to this day, you know, a lot of the special activities guys come out of the special ops community and wind up in the CIA.
00:23:09
I mean, there's a number of people in this book, I, you know, who I meant, I already mentioned one, you know, they went to work for the intelligence community after they retired from the military.
00:23:17
So they kind of like had two careers.
00:23:19
I'm, yes, it's incredible.
00:23:21
So the liaison relationship is always there.
00:23:25
The support relationship is there.
00:23:27
And today, there's a formalized process where the CIA can request special operations support.
00:23:34
And I'm told vice versa, special operations can request CIA support.
00:23:39
So that is that is now a formalized process that exists.
00:23:43
No, and I think it's it's something that again, I hope that when when kind of the American people read the book, they certainly get that the sense of, you know, how much we've worked together over the years.
00:23:54
I just, you know, as a side of my career, you know, some of the, some of the most, you know, I think impactful and frankly exciting and vigorating operations I ran were done jointly.
00:24:04
I remember even even at the at the risk of getting my headquarters annoyed with me, you know, I, I, I was in some conflict zone and I take a member either of an ODA, a special forces ODA or someone from the SEAL teams to an operational meeting.
00:24:19
You know, to an agent meeting and I would come back and someone would ask what the hell did you do that for?
00:24:24
I'm like, they're in the same fricking team.
00:24:26
They live next to me.
00:24:27
They're, they have T.S.
00:24:29
clearance and they're going to action, you know, a target based on intelligence.
00:24:32
Why would I not do this?
00:24:34
So I think they're always made a lot of sense to me.
00:24:37
Let me just say one more time we defy the lost chapters of special forces history.
00:24:42
Before we go to the break, Jack, I really, I wish you the best with his walk.
00:24:46
I can't wait to read it.
00:24:48
I hope you're going to certainly do it.
00:24:50
Do a lot more kind of publicity with it.
00:24:51
I don't know if you're going to do a special team house episode.
00:24:53
Yeah, we're doing one tonight talking about it.
00:24:56
Awesome.
00:24:56
Yeah.
00:24:56
This is the point in the podcast.
00:24:58
We have to say goodbye to our guests who are not yet subscribers.
00:25:01
If you want to listen to the rest of the pod, all the other shows and pull just go to the DSR network.com and click on membership.
00:25:06
It's only $7 a month and it brings you a lot of great bonus content.
00:25:09
If you're not a subscriber, we hope you will be soon.
00:25:12
And if you are one standby, we will be right back in a moment.
00:25:17
Thank you for listening to Above Average Intelligence hosted every week by Mark Polly Moropolis.
00:25:26
Above Average Intelligence is a DSR network production.
00:25:31
[Music]
00:25:41
